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Justus Schulz's avatar

That was a great article! Yet I ask for your help in understanding the overall point better. I understand you thusly:

If Tradition were truly infallible, both groups (Catholic, Orthodox) would agree on it. ["it" being which Tradition] Since they don’t, it suggests that either:

a) Tradition is not actually infallible, or

b) The disagreements are a sign that infallibility in Tradition cannot be *demonstrated*.

-> I would say demonstrated easily.

This problem forces the debate back to Scripture, as it is universally accepted as infallible across all orthodox Christian traditions. Thus, when Catholic, Orthodox, and Protestant apologists debate issues like the papacy, they inevitably appeal to Scripture to support their positions.

-> Is your point that one must *practically* agree with Sola Scriptura, even if one does not do so in a matter of epistemology or ontology/metaphysics?

Secondly. Even though I do think that Scriptural infallibility is a useful basis for orthodox Christians to argue from, it is not the only one they use. The use of reason is always implied with that. Deductions purely from reason, and from nature [in conjunction with reason,] are also coherent on that framework. Which means philosophical argument - the very least those of applied logics and mathematics - and those from natural science can be used as well; either to put away with some anti-scientific interpretations of the Bible or to argue for a philosophical ground of interpretation to begin with.

Without the addition of "rationalism," by which I mean the usage of reason to discover truths at all and the belief in a teleological world in which everything has a reason or cause, the vector of Scriptural infallibility is not well regulated. Using the Bible alone, one may come to the Catholic Church, or the Orthodox one, but many dogmas must simply be introduced by Church authority and, if that authority was not argued for well enough, serve at most as a theory if using the Bible alone. This may lead to a minimalism where one does not calculate the different positions, but reduces the faith to a basic set of agreed-upon principles, disregarding theological complexity and any depth. Doctrinal development through reason and the guidance of the Church become an impossibility from the outset because one cut off the Bible from "natural truths."

When it comes to praxis, I would argue for a Rationalistic Sola Scriptura from which Church authority can be deduced logically or mathematically in relation to philosophy and theology, or from the Bible in relation to philosophy or theology.

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Johnathon's avatar

I appreciate the way you’ve laid out this discussion so clearly. I wanted to give some brief thoughts and then share some extensive quotes from St. Dumitru Staniloae’s The Experience of God, Volume 1, from a chapter entitled “Scripture and Tradition” because I think they communicate the relationship between Scripture and Tradition better than I could. I have come to see Scripture and Tradition as inseparably interrelated, in that they are both necessary in a broader process of “living dialogue” between God and the Church, within which salvation is worked out. The use of the term ‘Scripture’ implies an understanding of the meaning of its contents which, I think we can both agree, is hotly contested among the many groups who self-identify as Christian. This is a commonly stated point, but it is brought up so often for good reason: what use is the infallibility of Scripture if we have no infallible means of interpretation? If I know that the Bible is infallible, but I don’t know in any given situation that I am understanding or applying it properly, then where does that leave me? For an improper understanding or use of an infallible text renders its infallibility moot. Thus, the infallibility of both Scripture and Tradition (being Scripture’s living and infallible interpretative framework and mechanism of application to the lives of humans) needs to rest squarely on the authority of the Holy Spirit, if we are to overcome this problem. You might respond that this problem still exists and ask the following question: how can we infallibly identify which “Tradition” is in fact correct? To which I would respond: Tradition must find its roots in the actual life of Christ, who chose, taught, and sent the Apostles, who themselves handed down that teaching through their successors the bishops, so on and so forth. You could still perhaps argue that the historical trajectory of this Tradition through time has been muddied, confused, corrupted, etc. such that a form of pure Tradition has not been passed down without interruption (which, to be clear, I would disagree with), but I can understand this perspective, given the messiness of history. You can point out that Roman Catholics and Orthodox disagree about which Church has the genuine and unbroken Tradition, but their disagreement does not bear upon the facticity of the genuine transmission of Tradition (I.e., either the Orthodox are correct, the Catholics are correct, or the Protestants are correct, or I suppose they could technically all be incorrect). But I think that regardless of the details of this debate, Tradition is in principle necessary for the actual practical use of Scripture as an infallible authority. To be sure, Tradition must be assimilated subjectively by each generation and even each person (in the context of a Church) because it is engaged in and transmitted as a dialogue between persons (man in communion with each other and God). At any rate, enough of my soapboxing! Check out the following excerpts from St. Dumitru’s Experience of God, Volume 1 (in a separate comment as a reply to this one), which might at least give you a better understanding of one of the perspectives on the matter (as it did me):

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